Post 268
I realize that in our troubled and fearful times, a study in Beasts and horns, Empires and materials, Body parts and elements, Horses and colors, is all just an irrelevant confusion of things that really don’t seem to relate to your frayed life that is one strand away from coming undone. But I assure you that God did not spend such a huge portion of his word just to give you an irrelevant fanciful insight into a future that you will not be part of. This “insight” IS immeasurably important to your real life, in the here-and-now, as well as in the one to come. If you can stay with my long and detailed interpretation of these things, we are getting to the world-shaking meaning that really does apply to you. But just when we get there in this study is a real question, as evidenced by this full post, which was really just a footnote of the last topic in progress; We are studying the clay.
In our continuing study we rightly deduced that you cannot make clay out of dust without water. And since we logically deduced from scripture that all clay is earthy and therefore human, we must ask the question; “What makes the variations?” For example: What makes Miry Clay as opposed to Mortar Clay, as in, what makes Mortar Clay different than Marred Potter’s Clay?
Although the condition of the clay has other affecting causes, I propose that the difference in the clay “DNA” is in the kind of water with which the clay is made.
Marred Clay?
Although the condition of the clay has other affecting causes, I propose that the difference in the clay “DNA” is in the kind of water with which the clay is made.
“Of course; “kinds” of iron, “kinds” of clay, and now “kinds” of water! Is there anything simple?”
Well yes there is, Salvation:
“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned” Mark 16:16.
But since we can’t seem to comprehend that in the simple form, we need to investigate the details in order to believe. And so we are.
* * *
The Water(s)(s):
The scriptures tell us that right after the beginning of creation there was water above the firmament as well as below:
“And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so” Genesis 1:6-7.
This is more than a simple myth of how everything came to be, but the explanation is going to take more than a one-line answer. For now, simply note that there was this “God placed defined barrier” between two different waters. OK? Then the passage tells us that after this division but before the creation of man, it never rained; instead it misted from the earth:
“These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created…for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground. And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground…” Genesis 2:4-7.
Why is this important? Because before there was rain, the water that God used to make man from earthen dust had to have come specifically from the earth as the mist that watered it. The Potter’s Clay is made from all earthborn elements under the firmament. The scriptures never mention rain again until Genesis 7:4 when God sent The Flood that destroyed all mankind, saving eight, in the days of Noah.
It is commonly concluded that this flood was the first rain, but is that true? It doesn’t actually say. But we must recognize by the Genesis 2:4 topic being “the generations of the heavens and of the earth” at their creation and by the wording concerning the divided state of waters before God made man, that God might have made it rain right after man was set on earth. The reason we are not told here is because the point made by verse 5 is that man’s clay was not made from rainwater. After man was created, whether it rained or not just doesn’t matter to the topic of the generations of the heavens and the earth at their creation; i.e. how things were made, (though it does matter for another reason that we will not get into yet). But before we move on, it is curious to note that, even in the divided state, the waters are still plural within each group; thus my “water(s)(s)” heading. We will discuss the reason later.
Now, after man was created, we can investigate the various kinds and states of water:
* * *
Rain Water:
Although the method is unseen, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to comprehend that rain is simply a “mysterious” product of the earthborn bodies of water. It is silly to think of a lake suddenly Quantum-leaping out of its earthen bowl-like containment into the air, but not a bit silly to think of it happening molecule by molecule on an individual basis; that is in truth exactly what it does through the transforming “magic” of evaporation.
This is a temporal Type of humanity unshockingly departing earth as individuals in death being “magically” transformed to fly unseen into heaven (Hebrews 9:27, I Thessalonians 4:13-14), but just as silly or shocking to think of it happening all at once in what we commonly call the still anticipated Rapture (I Thessalonians 4:16-17, Matthew 24:31, II Thessalonians 2:1).
My point is that rain is just as earthborn as mist rising from the ground (I didn’t say earthbound), but to become rain the water must first go through a specific liberating process of turning from liquid to gas at the prompting of the sun (Son).
Sometime after man was made and established on earth, we then see the implementation of the natural process of rain, which describes our anticipated future return to earth with the Lord Jesus after the remaining faithful are caught up in a one-time “quantum leap” relocation (I Corinthians 15:52, I Thessalonians 3:13, 4:14).
God did not want any confusion of the origin of man and so informed us that he made man from the unliberated earthborn materials before he made rain a complex variation of earthborn water. He kept his Typology of creation perfect.
We might get proud of our spiritual understanding and even our knowledge in the unseen science of evaporation (our soul after death) but this is hardly a great faith; it’s simply an understanding of what we know happens though we cannot see the intermediate process. To learn HOW it happens doesn’t change reality but it does affect our perspective of it and our ability to intelligently interact with it, which does change our reality in a way.
In simple ignorance of the process we might suppose that evaporation only represents our death and our liberated soul rising to heaven, and in effect it does, but if we examine that line of reason there are elements of the Type that don’t fully equal up: Evaporated water does not leave a “water shell” behind; the water itself is completely changed from one form to another while remaining the same elements of H2O. This does not accurately represent death as our body is temporarily left behind, and so this inequality in the parable shows that we have not rightly made the full connection (Proverbs 26:7). The mystery of the water continues:
* * *
Groundwater-like:
In the previous post we saw that the thing that makes the Morter unusable to the Potter is its Miry characteristic that is caused by a bubbling up like water:
Morter/Clay 2563 chomer; from 2560; properly, a bubbling up, i.e. of water, a wave; of earth, mire or clay (cement); also a heap; hence, a chomer or dry measure:-- clay, heap, homer, mire, motion.
2560 chamar; a primitive root; to boil up; hence, to ferment (with scum); to glow (with redness); as denominative (from 2564) to smear with pitch:-- daub, befoul, be red, trouble.
Morter Clay has an odd nature of both dry earth like cement but also a clay-like movement in “heaping up” dry earth, or a miry water kind of wave running through dry ground. How is this possible? Well this describes an earthquake quite accurately! We call it liquification.
And while we see that Morter has a primary property of undulating cured cement, the miry kind of bubbling up sure sounds a lot like the effervescing description of Miry 3121. And remember Hamor, the prince in the land and father of the giant that raped Dinah? Chamer 2560 was the foundation of his name meaning a red he-ass. Morter Clay has a very similar volatile disposition as Miry Clay but with far more solidity, which makes it even more dangerous because of its apparent trustworthiness, like David’s son who raped Tamar. “Willful” might be a reasonable descriptive word but I think “Contentious” works even better (Romans 2:8, II Corinthians 11:16 regarding v.14). You don’t build on Miry Ground because it’s miry, but the contention in earthquake soil causes horrific devastation in dry ground, which, before the eruption you might build on, thinking it is stable.
Do you know any Christians whose feet are obviously planted on the solid ground of the faith yet their immediate first response to every discussion always seems to be an argument or a general negative reaction and even a boiling troubled spirit of anger? Hmmm. Is it possible that this is dried out Potter’s clay with far too much groundwater perspective and not enough rainwater focus?
“Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God” Colossians 3:2-3.
That pretty much sounds like the description of evaporation! But notice that this is an instruction that we can control here on earth before we die physically. And now we understand the Type represented by the evaporation of water into the sky to be returned as purified water, this is a description of Salvation and a changed spirit. We die to our earthborn flesh and are made alive as the rain from heaven. So it seems that even as the Potter’s clay with a groundwater-like bubbling contention, by letting the Potter vigorously work us, our condition can still be changed before we are cast from the Potter’s wheel as worthless Miry or Morter. The key is where we set our affection.
“So what is so bad about groundwater? It’s the same earthborn origin as mist.”
Yes it is, and that’s a problem. God wants to water the whole earth but both mist and groundwater are very limited (Jeremiah 3:3+ 5:24+ 14:22), therefore it must be liberated (=51:15-16). Also mist and rainwater are pure while groundwater contains many contaminates such as Giardia (*1). The liberation process leaves the contaminations behind, and there is no clean rain without beginning as earthborn water. Man was created from clean mist that quickly went to ground and naturally became contaminated, with the Creator’s original intent of being then liberated. The whole process fails if the water is not successfully liberated and returned to the clay as pure. But the clay does not easily relinquish its love of the groundwater that it possesses.
Now let’s talk about something beyond current scientific understanding; let’s talk about water that is not of an earthborn origin.
* * *
The Water(s) of Noah’s Flood:
We all know the story of Noah’s flood but here is a verse to remind us of how the earth was flooded:
“For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth” Genesis 7:4.
That is a lot of rain!
Now with this verse we can be confident that we know the source of all that water was obviously rain right? Well, not quite. If we use our basic knowledge of science we can easily prove that concept wrong; rain doesn’t add any more water than is already on earth, it just cycles water from one place to another through evaporation. So how can we believe the bible when it claims that by raining, the whole earth flooded?
Well, it doesn’t actually say that. But if you have faith you don’t need the complex details and this verse gets the functional point made without complexity.
Now if that is the only verse you read on the subject then yes, that is the meaning you get from it, and it works, but to camp on a one-verse theology can really cause embarrassment when the concept is challenged by even a casual thinker. By reading the whole bible we understand that this verse does not actually say what it sounds like it is saying. There are actually two statements connected here:
1. It rained for 40 days and 40 nights.
2. Every living substance on the planet was destroyed.
The semicolon with an “and” clearly connects these two statements to a singular event but by other verses we learn that there was far more involved;
“In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, (647 years old) the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened. And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights” Genesis 7:11-12.
Why would God go into such detail to tell us it was raining? Well, if we really read this it tells us there are three sources of the floodwaters:
1. The fountains from within the earth,
2. The windows of heaven,
3. And 40 days of rain.
“Welll, OK~” I hear you say with hesitation; “We do have a clear second source of water that seems to add volume to the flood but windows of heaven and rain are just too alike to call them separate.”
Fair enough, but clearly we now have a below source and an above source that is starting to sound reminiscent of God’s divided firmament waters.
And since we have discovered a second source other than just rain, let’s look at why God seems to have also separated windows from rain. We find our answer in Genesis 8:1-3 as God began the after flood clean-up:
“And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters asswaged (7918);” Genesis 8:1.
Asswaged 7918 shakak; a primitive root; to weave (i.e. lay) a trap; figuratively, (through the idea of secreting) to ally (passions; physically, abate a flood):-- appease, assuage, make to cease, pacify, set.
Although verse 1 describes the stopping of a generic flood of waters (again in the plural), verse 2 shows us the details that confirm what we saw in 7:11,
“The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained;” Genesis 8:2.
Here we have three sources: The deep, the rain, and also water coming through the windows of heaven.
Ya I hear you cry; “Nitpicking!” but bear with me a moment longer.
IF the waters were above the firmament and below the firmament as we are told in Genesis 1:7, and the firmament is defined as the 7549 expanse of the sky, then speaking accurately, ordinary rain would have to fall from the firmament not through windows in the firmament. The only way rain could come through such windows is if the water was actually above the sky…. Just as we are told it was.
Now don’t get me wrong, it was indeed raining from the sky too, but this is a specifically described source of water other than the rain. Read v.3 again and it’s easy to see that only two of the three sources of water were “stopped”; from the deep and from above the firmament by an aswaging depletion. The rain within the firmament was only “restrained” because God allows the normal rain to continue in restrained moderation as I confirm by looking out my window today.
There is no doubt that God makes a clear distinction between rain from below the firmament and the waters above the firmament that apparently fell like rain in a one-time reverse Rapture kind of event. So now we have a clearer explanation of where all the extra water came from and the deeper meaning when God said it was going to RAIN!
Since this post is about the different kinds of waters as they relate to the “They” clay of Daniel 2:43 I will not be going into the science of all that water above the sky or where it all went after the flood. By now we should be seeing that scripture really does explain itself if we just ask it to.
* * *
The Waters Above the Firmament:
So in the process of making more clay, what if we add to the basic dust of the earth waters that do not come from the earth?
We still end up with what seems to be exactly the same clay of dust and H2O but by God’s clear distinction of separation with the firmament divider it’s obviously not of the “same stuff” as earth’s earthborn waters.
So how would the segregated waters that belong above the firmament, get down to the earth and mix with the dust as the waters below do? It would seem necessary to fall from where they were, like rain. Because of its source it’s not the same as rain but who is to know the difference by its appearance or function? The difference is in its origin!
I’m pretty sure you see where I’m going with this; The waters above the firmament were the real life temporal Type of the angels (in the plural) that in a point in time, fell to earth (Revelation 12:4), and mixed with the seed of humanity by breeding with Potter’s Clay women (Jude 1:6a +Romans 1:26), producing very human clay products but with a very different nature; The nature of Celestial Mire:
“There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another” I Corinthians 15:40.
Now from the marred Potter’s Clay point of view, in an arrogance to think it knows better than the Potter (Romans 9:20), the Clay thinks to himself; “Hey, this is a great way to avoid the contaminates of the earthborn water! I’m actually helping the Potter accomplish his desire to glorify humanity!” This is the vehicle of Miry Clay.
“And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potter’s clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay” Daniel 2:41.
Until this last kingdom group associated with the toes, we did not see any Miry Clay. The point of verse 40 was that they all; legs, feet, and toes, are strong as iron and so break everything they contact, and they contact everywhere. Therefore the distinction between the several iron parts is wholly in the additional clay. But because the clay portion is defined even further by verse 42 compared against v.41 compared against v.40, we must accept that the clay itself has even more discoverable distinctions than Potter and Miry. Verse 41 appears to be speaking of the iron but it’s really discussing the various clays:
Verse 41a further defines the final feet-and-toes clay as Potter’s (as if there was some other kind to be distinguished from), and this potter’s clay nature is what already divides the kingdom from its iron nature portion.
“Ok fine, we get that.”
Yes, but now we know for certain that the Potter’s Clay of this verse is plainly and completely human, What is not defined is whether it’s good or bad humanity and to what degree: Generic Potter’s, Marred Potter’s, or Morter. The reason is because it doesn’t matter to the point! The intended point of the verse is that it is humanity; earthen potter’s clay in general, with all its unspoken various conditions, in contrast to another kind of clay.
Now do you remember way back in the law of Moses, that God made an obscure and backward rule regarding wearing cloths made from woolen mingled with linen? I seem to remember it said something about mixing kinds:
“Ye shall keep my statutes. Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind: thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woolen come upon thee” Leviticus 19:19.
If God was concerned enough, even way back at the beginning, about not letting two different kinds of waters mix so that he divided it with a firmament, it is just possible that he really has more than a pet peeve about mixing kinds, and he really might not be insane for not wanting his people to wear cloths made with “kind” different materials carded together into thread or yarn (Deuteronomy 22:11).
Notice he did not say don’t make your cattle mix kinds, it says don’t even let them! This is not only a command against it, it is saying first; that it is possible, and second; it’s our job to make sure it doesn’t happen. That seems to be a far cry from today’s scientists working very hard to try and make it happen to the greatest extremes, even when it’s naturally impossible without genetic manipulation they call “gene splicing.” I’m getting the impression this is not going to turn out well for them…. And I’m not talking about the animals!
Water.
Who would have thought that God would even want to keep waters separated from waters? God must really have “a thing” against Chimeras of every kind! I wonder if it’s because they can do what he doesn’t want done?
Now, let’s just take this hypothesis one step further:
Remember that when God destroys and makes a new heaven and a new earth (Isaiah 65:17), there will be no more sea:
“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea” Revelation 21:1.
So backing up to the addition of all that extra water when he destroyed the earth with a flood, what are the chances that the waters above the firmament was salt water?! NOW suddenly we can imagine a very distinct difference in waters, even while seeing that waters appear just like waters; water is water.
This of course is only a theory at this time, but worth a consideration. When God fixes the wrong and creates a new heaven and a new earth, the salt water will be eliminated from the natural order. If the scientists are looking for something to do, figure out how this dynamic will work, and by it, learn what we can do now to improve life to some degree of imitation. After all, the ocean is the earth’s septic system, how do you get along without it?
* * *
The Firmament Miry “They” Clay:
And now the second half of Daniel 2:41 speaks of a different topic than the division between people of clay and the law of iron, commonly called a Republican form of Government. This half of the verse is no longer talking about the division but about the strength. In the description of the division the nature of the clay was Potter’s, but in this description of strength the nature of the clay is Miry. The two kinds of clay included in a single sentence is important; We now see the “other” clay that made the earlier distinction of “Potter’s” necessary.
I am proposing that this “waters of the firmament” Miry Clay is the hybrid element in the clay that then incorporates its values into the iron itself that makes it capitol “I” brand Iron with a new unique strength because of the addition of the Miry part of the clay to do things that generic clay or iron does not do. Now, all in a single verse, we have Democratic Miry Potter’s Clay dividing the kingdom from its hybrid Republican Iron/Morter Clay strength. Read verse 41 again with this in mind, the wording of this verse even suggests that this Empire of feet-and-toes is mostly a two-part Democratic clay, but it is still strong forasmuch as we saw iron mixed with the Miry Clay portion. The Mortered Potter’s Clay influence is no longer its iron strength as with Rome, because the human Potter’s Clay masses stand in opposition to what the Celestial Mire drives the Roman kind of iron to do: Break in pieces and stamp the residue of all things.
But now if the Potter’s Clay was actually weak, the kingdom would not be divided because the iron could dominate the opposition. So here we see the Democratic masses also have power and this power of the masses is what divides the kingdom from its iron goals.
I submit that this is exactly what we are seeing begin to take place both in governments around the world and in Islam itself as many of its Marred Potter’s Clay people simply want peace, but the Morter people have the power of the Iron in their hands and so attempt to break all things, including the Potter’s Clay portion of their own kingdoms. The question is; are these violent clay people actually Miry Clay or are they just mired Morter people doing a great job of playing the part!
Who’s to say?! Genesis 6 mixes these two elements of responsibility so well that it cannot be ciphered. Are the angels already breeding with human women to produce the Miry Clay? It seems apparent that they are, but let’s not jump to conclusions.
The divided democratically contested Republic of powerful iron-law is what creates the v.41a primary division of the kingdom, but this is nothing strange; it has happened often before and is recently even the description of divided America today, therefore this concept is not the meaning of; “as iron is not mixed with clay” seen in v.43.
The answer to “is it? or isn’t it?” mixed yet, comes when we realize that at the Miry Clay of v.41 the topic that follows is no longer speaking of the divided kingdom which “is,” but is now speaking of the Miry Clay itself as it has its own internal schism of “isn’t”; The iron isn’t completely iron.
The marvel is how the miry clay is incorporated into the iron itself, and what its unique properties enable the new brand Iron to do, and what it can’t do. Now go read v.41 yet again, dividing it at the “But” to see the strength is in fact the Iron/Miry Clay mixture and not the iron vs. Potter’s Clay division.
Now let’s add verse 43:
“And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle (6151) themselves with the seed (2234) of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay” Daniel 2:43.
Mingle 6151 arab; (Chaldean) ar-ab’; corresponding to 6148; to commingle:-- mingle (self), mix.
6148 ‘arab, aw-rab’; a primitive root; to braid, i.e. intermix; technical to traffic (as if by barter); also to give or be security (as a kind of exchange):-- engage, (inter-) meddle (with), mingle (self), mortgage, occupy, give pledges, be (-come, put in), surety, undertake.
Seed 2234 zera’; (Chaldean) corresponding to 2233; posterity:-- seed.
Since we are plainly told in v.41b that the strength of the iron is by the mixing with clay, it is important to note that in verse 42 the iron-and-clay-mixture-conflict then becomes an analogy of the two kinds of clay in one empire that has the same kind of schism. This mixed-but-not-mixed conflict between clays then becomes its own analogy of the conflict within the Miry Clay itself of verse 43 and is for practical purposes exclusive of the iron other than the fact of its existence in the nature of the hybrid clay. The example and meaning of iron in verse 43 is about the Miry Clay and the seed of men with which it mingles and is using the earlier iron-law/democracy-conflict and the different kinds-of-clay-conflict simply as examples; This demonic hybrid Clay of violent-nature-and-peace is going to endure quite a struggle to remain among the Potter’s Clay of humanity without destroying it entirely, though they are both human in every discernible way but for the very origins of their natures:
“Shall not all these take up a parable against him, and a taunting proverb against him, and say, Woe to him that increaseth that which is not his! How long? and to him that ladeth himself with thick clay (5671)! Habakkuk 2:6.
Thick Clay 5671 ‘abtiyt; from 5670; something pledged, i.e. (collectively) pawned goods:-- thick clay [by a false etymology].
5670 ‘abat; a primitive root; to pawn; causatively to lend (on security); figuratively to entangle:-- borrow, break [ranks], fetch [a pledge], lend, X surely.
Etymology: the history of a linguistic form (as a word) shown by tracing its development since its earliest recorded occurrence in the language where it is found…
I’m under the impression that this means it’s a pun or creative word-play for affect. This sounds a lot like “mingle,” with Ecconomic overtones of greedy immoral Merchants and Merchandizing.
So who is this man? 1:3-4 tells us it could be any wicked Morter man but 1:6 tells us it is speaking specifically of The Assyrian; the king of the Chaldeans, and by other scripture we know this is ultimately speaking of the Antichrist; i.e. Satan in the clay of flesh.
So it would seem that the Antichrist has entangled himself with a people that become a burden that he can’t shake. Poor guy! Clearly this is not speaking of his own kind and so must be speaking of the human seed of Daniel 2:43. Apparently this does not turn out as he had planned!
So who are those that he becomes entangled with? Again obviously not his own kind, but the passage goes on to give us a clue:
“Shall they not rise up suddenly that shall bite thee, and awake that shall vex thee, and thou shalt be for booties unto them?” Habakkuk 2:7.
Daniel 7:18, 26-27 tells us the people that make a booty of him (in the plural; including his “people” in both forms) are the saints of the Most High. And while that is exciting, don’t miss that it is also “they” whom were previously entangled by him. The saints are first the mired Potter’s Clay of the Daniel 2 passage!
But, I get ahead of myself. We are still identifying one clay from the other by their waters (*2):
* * *
Identifying The Clays:
“The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; the enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the (faithful) angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world” Matthew 13:38-40.
“In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother” I John 3:10.
It is pretty hard to get any clearer that the seed of Satan, we saw back in Genesis 3:15, are clearly anyone who does not DO RIGHTEOUSNESS, This includes anyone who does not love his fellow man… regardless of the condition in which he finds his Potter’s Clay!
So what does God tell us we must do with our enemies?
“And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? For sinners also do even the same…But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil. Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful” Luke 6:33-36.
So, IF we are to love our brother humanity, in every state he is found, and IF we are to love our enemies, even if they are not just unthankful but actually evil, and IF we cannot distinguish Satan’s Celestial Clay from the Earthen Clay, Are we to treat anyone in any way but love? Of course not! It is not in our job description to hate or even to avenge ourselves (I John 4:20, Romans 12:19), and Jude 1:6-9 removes all question to this topic.
But now before you go off all half-cocked to boldly call every sinner a demon child (in love of course), we get an interesting bit of clarification:
“And I will punish him and his seed and his servants for their iniquity…” Jeremiah 36:31.
Clearly God defines a difference between Satan’s hybrid seed and his completely human servants who may just need an alternative option. But in the end the humans are punished with the rest if they don’t find repentance:
“Ah sinful nation, a people laden with iniquity, a seed of evildoers, children that are corrupters: they have forsaken (5800) the LORD, they have provoked the Holy One of Israel unto anger, they are gone away backward” Isaiah 1:4.
Forsaken 5800 ‘azab; a primitive root; to loosen, i.e. relinquish, permit, etc.:-- commit self, fail, forsake, fortify, help, leave (destitute, off), refuse, X surely.
You cannot forsake what you never had; these people are the “used to be faithful.” Israel and now America are two primary examples.
Now you tell me: if demon children already look the same as their human counterparts, and then their human counterparts act the same as the demon children, how can the difference be identified? Answer: it can’t! The one and only distinguishing difference would be by their actions, which are the same. This is why I John 3:10 made it clear that words and claims mean nothing.
So how is a Christian, living under works-less dirty grace, going to be identified as different than the demon children in the Day of Judgment? Answer: they wont! (Matthew 7:21-28, Luke 13:24 [verse 25 speaks of those Christians left behind right after the Rapture], Hebrews 3:10-11, 4:6, etc.).
So now how important is your voluntary testimony of conduct?
But there’s still more.
* * *
Broken Pottery:
“And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken” Daniel 2:42.
Now we know that divided by the “so” are a set of comparable examples begun by the “as,” and not intending to mean a description of the singular feet and toes kingdom itself. Replace the “feet and toes” bit with “the 8th kingdom” and it is easier to see the meaning. It is talking about the two natures of the clay in that particular kingdom that had not yet come.
With the background we have now compiled, it seems evident that the Miry Clay is not the broken part described in v.42; that iron-clay is the strong part. This kind of mingling is really entangled (Proverbs 6:1-5, 11:15, 17:18, 20:16-17, 27:12-13) and so we gather that it is the Potter’s Clay that becomes fragile by drying out its water of life that kept it pliable clay. All that is left is for the former Potter’s Clay to be crushed to powder as iron breaks all things.
“Burning lips and a wicked heart are like a potsherd (2789 a piece of pottery) covered with silver dross” Proverbs 26:23.
“My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death” Psalm 22:15.
“Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! Let the potsherd strive with the potsherds of the earth (“Pick on someone your own size”). Shall the clay say to him that fashioned it, What makest thou? Or thy work (say), He hath no hands? (meaning; “he did a lousy job”)” Isaiah 45:9.
“And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even (like) as I received of my father (at the hands of men)” Revelation 2:26-27.
What is it that causes this potter’s clay to so dry out and become fragile?
“Now go, write it before them in a table, and note it in a book, that it may be fore the time to come for ever and ever:
That this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the LORD: (children) which say to the seers see not; and to the prophets, Prophesy not unto us right things, speak unto us smooth things, prophesy deceits (II Timothy 4:3-4): Get you out of the way, turn aside out of the path, cause the Holy One of Israel to cease from before us.
Wherefore thus saith the Holy One of Israel, Because ye despise this word, and trust in oppression and perverseness, and stay thereon: Therefore this iniquity shall be to you as a breach ready to fall, swelling out in a high wall, whose breaking cometh suddenly at an instant.
And he shall break it as the breaking of the potter’s vessel that is broken in pieces; he shall not spare: so that there shall not be found in the bursting of it a sherd to take fire from the hearth, or to take water withal out of the pit” Isaiah 30:8-14.
The scriptures have much more to say on this specific people, but for now it is enough to note that these are not the unusable Miry Clay, these are the Potter’s Clay gone bad; these are his special work on more than one wheel, which Jeremiah went to his house and saw him destroy because of its marred state, and then make it again after it was properly re-stressed… And if that stressing wasn’t enough, these are those who after a second reshaping still refused to hold their given shape! At some point the clay is no longer workable, it is too dried out in the improper shape of its stubbornness (I Samuel 15:23). When this happens there is nothing more the potter can do but to utterly destroy it. It has no worth. It is therefore broken to bits and discarded to be trodden (Job 6:6+Matthew 5:13+Luke 14:33-35).
So which is worse; Morter Clay or Broken Clay? I don’t think it really matters, but the piled corpses of Morter can at least be stacked like bricks for a wall of defense after they are sent through the kiln (said dryly). The reason why the scripture makes a distinction at all is to show HOW they became so destroyed; there are more than one way to be corrupted. Such knowledge benefits our avoidance (*3).
One clay is violently unstable by the piling up of supposedly solid ground, while the other is not pliable enough by the stubbornness of drying out. Another is so shapeless that it bends to any and every wind of doctrine as a shape to try until the next one strikes its fancy.
Before we move on it should be noted that Miry Clay does not just mingle with Potter’s Clay. The potter’s Clay must first become compatible by a mar, that by reworking without a change of its earth-focused heart, becomes mired, miry, not Miry. And once sufficiently mired in groundwater, the Miry Waters from above the firmament can breed/mingle with the marred potters clay to create Miry Clay. The result is a new generation of sticky tar kind of clay that really seeks out the iron in order to succeed in its driving nature to corrupt or destroy everything.
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(*1) Giardia (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0001333/).
(*2) Scripturally, water represents a hard to define force of life:
(The footnote that was removed from Post 267 and expanded into Post 268).
The word “water” is used in scripture in a great many and variety of ways. Water is often used comparatively to describe something else, and is used as a metaphor in place of “something else,” but then there are many verses that use “something else” to describe this mysterious “water.” This is what we are looking for:
Proverbs 5:15 instructs us to “Drink waters out of thine own cistern, and running waters out of thine own well”. You tell me what that really means!
Proverbs 9:17 speaks of “stolen waters” in the same mystical way.
Proverbs 11:25 tells us to “water” others and in return will be “watered”.
Ecclesiastes 11:1 promises we will get our bread back if we “cast it upon the waters”.
Song of Solomon 8:7 warns that “many waters cannot quench love, neither can the floods drown it…”.
And on and on we read of this elusive “water” that makes me feel incompetent for not yet understanding what it really means. But then we get to the “waters” that are only slightly less cryptic, that I almost begin to understand:
“The waters saw thee, O God, the waters saw thee; they were afraid: the depths also were troubled. The clouds poured out water: the skies sent out a sound: thine arrows also went abroad…Thy way is in the sea, and thy path in the great waters, and thy footsteps are not known. Thou leddest thy people like a flock by the hand of Moses and Aaron” Psalm 77:16-20. Almost explained by Psalm 78:13.
I’m going to cut through a whole lot of research to arrive at the point. These mysterious passages lead us to comprehend in a non-practical way that God is speaking of a realm beyond our comprehension with which we are supposed to connect. These passages are leading us to other passages in this perspective that we will discuss later. But for now let’s just stop at Isaiah 8:7,
“Now therefore, behold, the Lord bringeth up upon them the waters of the river, strong and many, even the king of Assyria, and all his glory: and he shall come up over all his channels, and go over all his banks:”
These “waters” are not just people and troops, but are an unstoppable force of great power like the locust of Joel 2:7-9. What do you do to stop a wall of water? You can’t shoot it, cut it, or even grasp it by the arm, you cannot stand in its way. It is powerful and unyielding yet almost intangible. It is like some giant that is partially phased out of this realm yet retains the power to affect the realm that can hardly affect it. This is the “force” that is mixed with dust to make clay. It is the spirits.
“What is water?”
I think Isaiah explains it most plainly;
“For I (the LORD) will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon they seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring: and they shall spring up as among the grass, as willows by the water courses” Isaiah 44:3.
And Jesus explains it best:
“Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this (well)water shall thirst again: But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life” John 4:13-14.
“and Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst” John 6:35.
Notice that while he said he was the bread, he did not say he was the water. Jesus gives us the water that is not of this earth but neither is it the destroying water(s) that was from above the firmament. The water is clearly the most mysterious part of the clay.
I offer a possible distinction between waters in the plural, and the singular water that Jesus offers. If we capitalize his Water as a noun, suddenly we see he is speaking of the Holy Spirit, whereas the plural waters are the “other” spirits in diverse kinds, each man receiving his own and interacting with others.
(*3) Details?
Let it be known that due to the volume of information, in order to arrive at the end of this study before the end of the world comes (said tongue-in-cheek), I am forced to leave out even more details for you to rabbit trail on your own, such as the origin of mist and how it is different from rain, or how evaporation is different from evapotranspiration, and their individual complexities, etc. The full details of how scripture under a microscope is Typed in our reality are simply astounding!
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